What do you think life would be like today if John Kerry was president?

[Randel]

Do you think life would be different or similiar? Do you think the economy would have gone up or down? Do you think we would still be in or out of Iraq?

[user_1009]

they would still be in Iraq...Bush made a mess of iraq but you cant just leave cause things would only get worse.

[sammiedebull]

pretty much the same.

[Teffo]

sadam made a mess of iraq...it seems as though everyone just wants to point fingers at our president and everyone is forgetting how sadam opressed the people of iraq for almost 35 years

[caz]

^^ amen to that sista *:applause: , hello lets not forget we had a president that was worse then damn hitler, so lets have an open minded opinion here yeah we cant stand bush but wat he did for us we will never forget that, but as far as the states i hope they get better with their economy and all but that also aint just the states its world wide *:roll:

[ojeen1981]

teffo, the situation is more complicated than that, saddam is a minor figure in the global politcal arena. *Bush or Kerry, either way, nothing would have changed because in 1995 they passed documanted paper saying exactly how and when the US is gonna invade iraq, which happened before our eyes. *

Saddam is a clown who was trying to play with the big dogs..but failed....

IF anyone would like a historical perespective on this complicated issue plz feel free to pm me....its way too long to explain on here..God bless..peace

[tmsocha]

2nd Catholic President

[ojeen1981]

first was JFK

[missbaghdad]

Bush or Kerry, either way, nothing would have changed because in 1995 they passed documanted paper saying exactly how and when the US is gonna invade iraq, which happened before our eyes. *

What is that called or where can I find reference to that?

Thank you

[Teffo]

ojeen...why are you basing your comment to me?

[ojeen1981]

Project for the New American century, look that up, not only on site, but try to find some books..peace

[ojeen1981]

i was only commenting to the commnt u made that people are pointing the fingers at Bush and not saddam....the rest of my message was for everyone else..peace

[sammiedebull]

We had this conversation before, NEWBIES go look up and search :)

[flisha]

nothing will chang i will b just dog working for ever

[renee]

I would prolly be in a concentration camp. *:bang:

[UmiSayz]

sadam made a mess of iraq...it seems as though everyone just wants to point fingers at our president and everyone is forgetting how sadam opressed the people of iraq for almost 35 years


GET THE **** OUTTA HERE WITH THAT BUUULLLLLSHHHIIIIITTT! *:)

[Samuel]

*samd refrain from posting in this thread. *No matter how stupid the things that have been said so far, walk away....*

[UmiSayz]

*samd refrain from posting in this thread. *No matter how stupid the things that have been said so far, walk away....*


Do it Samd....DO IT!

[sammiedebull]

I agree with teffo, umi, its ok, sunni are out of power now, deal with it :)

[UmiSayz]

I agree with teffo, umi, its ok, sunni are out of power now, deal with it :)


I wasn't thinkin about that but yeh it doesn't matter. Theres more of us than you ;)

[Teffo]

if you're implying there are more muslims than christians that;'s wrong...

and samd...go ahead and make your remarks...teffo don't care :) she can always close out internet explorer :)

[Armenian]

http://img64.echo.cx/img64/7818/sonlyamassgravewiththousandsof.jpg

[Samuel]

Hah! *HAH!!!

Favorite Bush Quotes:

The United States and the U.S. stand together in support of the Iraqi people and the new Iraqi government, which will soon come into action.
* *-- Dubya redefines the coalition present in Iraq, Brussels, Belgium, Feb. 22, 2005

This notion that the United States is getting ready to attack Iran is simply ridiculous. And having said that, all options are on the table.
* *-- Having it both ways as usual, Brussels, Belgium, Feb. 22, 2005


It's in our country's interests to find those who would do harm to us and get them out of harm's way.
* *-- Wait a second. Wouldn't we want to put those people into harm's way? Otherwise, we'd kinda be helping them. Prime Time Press Conference, White House, Apr. 28, 2005

The United States has no right, no desire, and no intention to impose our form of government on anyone else. That is one of the main differences between us and our enemies.
* *-- Apparently he isn't counting the invasions, occupations and nation-building endeavors in Afghanistan and Iraq, 2005 State of the Union address, Washington, D.C., Feb. 2, 2005


WASHINGTON POST: Why do you think bin Laden has not been caught?
DUBYA: Because he's hiding.
* *-- Dubya offers a ludicrous answer to a serious question, interview with Michael A. Fletcher and Jim VandeHei of the Washington Post, aboard Air Force One, Jan. 14, 2005

[UmiSayz]

if you're implying there are more muslims than christians that;'s wrong...




No. More Sunnis than Shias. And we're getting up there close to the Christians...its just a matter of time Teffo.

[sammiedebull]

haha, im gonna kick you butt umi :)

[Anonymous]

it'sallFACKIN STUPID GEORGE W. BUSH FAULT...I'D RATHER WANT SADDAM BACK, AT LEAST MY UNCLE WOULD HAVE BEEN STILL ALIVE..
ERA GU STUPID GEORGE BUSH...

HE aint doing a great job hes a stupid president of america

PRESIDENT MY ASSHOLE

[UmiSayz]

haha, im gonna kick you butt umi :)


Please dont ;)

[UmiSayz]

it'sallFACKIN STUPID GEORGE W. BUSH FAULT...I'D RATHER WANT SADDAM BACK, AT LEAST MY UNCLE WOULD HAVE BEEN STILL ALIVE..
ERA GU STUPID GEORGE BUSH...

HE aint doing a great job hes a stupid president of america

PRESIDENT MY ASSHOLE


I actually agree with you. My grandpa would have a better chance to live also....

[Anonymous]

umisayz, My uncle lived in TORONTO FOR OVER 20 YRS, then he went back to iraq lived there for 6 YEARS, nothing happend to him, as soon as that mother facker george w shit went into iraq everything fell apart :(

im sorry to hear about your grandpa,

[maxpower]

Saddam Was The Not The Problem In Iraq, Yes He Is A Murder And All That, But He Did What He Had To Do To Keep This Country In Place, Iraqis Are Not Meant To Have Freedom, Everyone Wants To Control That Country, They Cant Stand Each Other, I Wish Saddam Comes Back And Runs That Country Again, To Late... Am Speaking From Experince, *My Dad Was A Top General In The Iraqi Airforce.

[Samuel]

Saddam Was The Not The Problem In Iraq, Yes He Is A Murder And All That, But He Did What He Had To Do To Keep This Country In Place, Iraqis Are Not Meant To Have Freedom, Everyone Wants To Control That Country, They Cant Stand Each Other, I Wish Saddam Comes Back And Runs That Country Again, To Late... Am Speaking From Experince, *My Dad Was A Top General In The Iraqi Airforce.


So this one time in high school we were debating the conflict in Iraq (this was before the war had started). *The debate struck a nerve amongst the foolish retards (follow: Republicans), because a few of the outspoken liberals were making very legitimate points against a unilateral invasion, especially without the approval of the UN Security Council (making the war, technically illegal). *Well this one girl decided that it was her turn to shine. *She started ranting about freedom, patriotism, and her dad's position in the military. *Her argument...before she started crying like a weird freak, was that since her father was in the military, her pro-war opinion mattered more than the rest of ours (she had admitted that it was entirely influenced by her father!). *While the class was "awwing," I couldn't help but laugh.

[renee]

Saddam Was The Not The Problem In Iraq, Yes He Is A Murder And All That, But He Did What He Had To Do To Keep This Country In Place, Iraqis Are Not Meant To Have Freedom, Everyone Wants To Control That Country, They Cant Stand Each Other, I Wish Saddam Comes Back And Runs That Country Again, To Late... Am Speaking From Experince, *My Dad Was A Top General In The Iraqi Airforce.

I can't believe what I'm reading. Following your logic (which is very flawed by the way) you would support the US government murdering anyone from the middle east because it would be "what we had to do to keep this country in place!" That's absurd.

Saddam's not comming back. But I can see why you'd want that. What's the matter, daddy can't order the use of weapons of mass destruction against the Iranians any more?

[UmiSayz]

"what we had to do to keep this country in place!"


I think he was saying Saddam is the only one who can control that country.

[FirePup]

Life would be different by which ever way the wind blows, if Kerry was president.

[Samuel]

If Kerry were President, the United States would have not retreated from Iraq. *Not for any of the previously stated reasons. *Certainly not because of some PNAC conspiracy, as Kerry is clearly neither a neo-conservative, nor adheres to such a school of thought. *But because we've already committed ourself knee-deep into democratizing Iraq, and abandoning such an investment seems absurd after already spending so much on it. *Plus it would be seen [internationally] as a failure on the Part of the United States. *The US uses Iraq as a model for the rest of the middle east. *It wants to make sure that it ends on a high note... not abandonment. *If we expect the Saudi masses to overthrow the royal family, Iranian intellectuals to instigate another revolution against the Islamic Republic to democratize, we need to promise a good model, namely Iraq, for them to follow. *If we admit failure in Iraq by retreating, instability ensues in the entire region. *No international theorist would be so short-sited. *Not even a liberal!

[sammiedebull]

samd said it perfectly, this is where we are at, we need to deal with it and fix it up somehow.

[maxpower]

i knew when i was writing this post,,, some ignorants would come and say some bullshit, just cause they were born here, and think that freedom exist in every country, wake up and smell the coffee you ignorants.... and renee, no comments toward you, because its a waste of breath, think outside the box, would you

[Anonymous]

maxpower, i swear i get sad everyday that my uncle died :( I cry everynight *because i misss my uncle sooooo *much, i wish saddam was still controling iraq, like i said at least my uncle would have been still alive, now my uncle's (uncle) which is my dad's uncle is dieing in iraq because what happend to my uncle, i feel bad for his little daughter whos only 6yrs old:( didnt get the chance to know her dad, uff man everytime i talk about this i get sad :( i should let my uncle r.i.p everyone remembers him as a great guy who brought so many ppl to CANADA, GOD BLESS HIM HE'S IN HEAVEN WITH GOD & VERY HAPPY :-)


I WISH GEORGE W SHIT DIES :-)

[maxpower]

andyswifey...sorry to hear that... thats one of the things we didnt want this war from the first place, because of things like that.. but this is life, and we gotta move on.. sorry again for your loss...

[ojeen1981]

To understand the complexities surrounding today’s politics of Iraq, we must appeal back to history, I suggest from 1958 when my hero Abdul Karrem Qassem overthrow the English controlled monarchy. *

This story is not about Saddam or Bush, its about following an ideology that would keep the American Economic system goining. *If anyone wishes to read more about this subject let me know..ill suggest some books....

Peace

[renee]

i knew when i was writing this post,,, some ignorants would come and say some bullshit, just cause they were born here, and think that freedom exist in every country, wake up and smell the coffee you ignorants.... and renee, no comments toward you, because its a waste of breath, think outside the box, would you

If your father really was a "top general" in the Iraqi Air Force it means he's prolly a war criminal. If he's not already dead, I hope there's an indictment waiting for him in The Hague at the International War Crimes Tribunal. Maybe they'll give him a cell next to Milosovic!

[maxpower]

No I Tell You What He Got... First Class Flight To Los Angeles, A House, A Car, And Life Time Protection From The American Government.. Did I Mention An Automatic Citizenship, And Am Here Enjoying The Lavish Life In La...and For Your Ignorant Mind, Not Everyone In Saddam's Era Was A Ciminal...but What You Know, Your Just Talking Out Of Your A**

[Samuel]

To understand the complexities surrounding today’s politics of Iraq, we must appeal back to history, I suggest from 1958 when my hero Abdul Karrem Qassem overthrow the English controlled monarchy. *

This story is not about Saddam or Bush, its about following an ideology that would keep the American Economic system goining. *


:roll: * So from what I understand of what you're saying... *Five men meet every sunday and decide the policies we "little" people (Bush and Saddam) pursue ? *


When you make these absurd claims...why don't you provide us with some proof rather than encourage us to contact you? *Considering your track record for saying nothing worthwhile, I don't feel it's worth our time to contact you individually. *

Btw... We invadid iraq base on the alinement of the stars and it has noting to do with the leeders. *contact me for more. peace.


edit: *Like my international relations (you definitely need this class) professor always said... If you can't spell, and lack grammatical fluency, then you've already lost all of your credibility.

[maxpower]

To understand the complexities surrounding today’s politics of Iraq, we must appeal back to history, I suggest from 1958 when my hero Abdul Karrem Qassem overthrow the English controlled monarchy. *

This story is not about Saddam or Bush, its about following an ideology that would keep the American Economic system goining. *


:roll: * So from what I understand of what you're saying... *Five men meet every sunday and decide the policies we "little" people (Bush and Saddam) pursue ? *


When you make these absurd claims...why don't you provide us with some proof rather than encourage us to contact you? *Considering your track record for saying nothing worthwhile, I don't feel it's worth our time to contact you individually. *

Btw... We invadid iraq base on the alinement of the stars and it has noting to do with the leeders. *contact me for more. peace.



agree, yet invading iraq was also a personal issue that has not been yet resolved between the bushes and Mr. Hussien...for that to happen they(bushes) had to brush up a stroy about WMD..

[ojeen1981]

i have no idea where u get that understanding from what i said. *

In 1958, when Abdul Karrem Qassem took power, he made many changes in Iraq's economic and political strucutres that was totaly against the intrests of the west, and before you know it, he was dubed a "communists". *Next step was to get rid of him. *to make a long long long story short, they put in saddam as their agent. *Iran Iraq war happens and iran/contra takes....and Iraq is left exhausted after an 8 year war. *

Saddam tried to get his money back from kuwait and was urging kuwait to stop using parallal driling on iraqi oil fields, in other words, saddam told kuwait to stop stealing Iraqi oil, kuwait told him to go to hell (if saddam was smart he would have seen that their r reason y kuwait is refusing a much more powerrful iraq and known US was behind them) . *NExt thing april gilpsy vists saddam and gives him the famous "green light" telling him thats its a "arab-arab conflict". *Saddam invades, bush senior declares war with his "new world order" ideology . *
anywayz, its complicated as hell..but samd dont try to anatagonize me cauze your an annyoing child. *get a life man..if u r gonna comment on anything i said, make sure its an intellegiant comment (dont matter if u agree or disagree) am done puttin up with your krusty the klownass....peeeeace

[ojeen1981]

samd, international relations? my BA...how nice....

So u do attend Krusty the Klown college....didnt know u they offer a class like that...good for u, moving up in the world !

[Samuel]

To understand the complexities surrounding today’s politics of Iraq, we must appeal back to history, I suggest from 1958 when my hero Abdul Karrem Qassem overthrow the English controlled monarchy. *

This story is not about Saddam or Bush, its about following an ideology that would keep the American Economic system goining. *


:roll: * So from what I understand of what you're saying... *Five men meet every sunday and decide the policies we "little" people (Bush and Saddam) pursue ? *


When you make these absurd claims...why don't you provide us with some proof rather than encourage us to contact you? *Considering your track record for saying nothing worthwhile, I don't feel it's worth our time to contact you individually. *

Btw... We invadid iraq base on the alinement of the stars and it has noting to do with the leeders. *contact me for more. peace.



agree, yet invading iraq was also a personal issue that has not been yet resolved between the bushes and Mr. Hussien...for that to happen they(bushes) had to brush up a stroy about WMD..

Well I don't doubt whatsoever, that the reason the US (under Bush) invaded Iraq was for the following reasons: *

1) OIL
2) Many theorists (namely, neo-conservatives) believe that two democracies are less likely to engage in conflicts. *Empirical evidence proves that politicians belonging to democracies are less likely to be aggressive towards one another because their constituents will hold them accountable for their 'pugnacious' demeanor. *Theorists also know that the Arabs embrace democracy (statistics prove this). *So if we put the concept of democracy into play in Iraq, it should "theoretically" spread like wildfire throughout the region...making our ability to attain goal #1 easier. *It's easier to convince masses of idiots (look at how affective we are in the south, and bible belt!) to vote in a particular manner, than to convince Saddam on what's best for his country. *Saddam isn't entirely stupid, but the masses...heh...we love their stupidity. :) *And even if a democracy doesn't work in our favor.. we can always help a politically charged group achieve a coup d'état, as we've done so in past democracies.

[Samuel]

samd, international relations? my BA...how nice....

So u do attend Krusty the Klown college....didnt know u they offer a class like that...good for u, moving up in the world !


How lovely. *You officially suck at everything. *Even the stuff you've paid $80k to learn.

[ojeen1981]

believe that two democracies are less likely to engage in conflicts

samd, u said something intellegiant for once, and i cant belive i agree with u. *

but rookie, the theory " that two democracies are less likely to engage in conflicts" was what the german philosopher Kant argued.

[Samuel]

Eh. *I'm three years younger than you. *I can take being called a "rookie."

[ojeen1981]

so we agree on something.

[david]

samd, *:applause:. I cannot agree with you more on this entire subject. There simply is no need for me to inject any material into this conversation because quite frankly, whatever you are learning in your international politics course parallels my thinking. What college do you attend, just out of curiousity?

[Samuel]

samd, *:applause:. I cannot agree with you more on this entire subject. There simply is no need for me to inject any material into this conversation because quite frankly, whatever you are learning in your international politics course parallels my thinking. What college do you attend, just out of curiousity?


Thanks a lot. *:D

UCSD (http://ucsd.edu).

[Anonymous]

Oil is the reason America went into iraq *how stupid can he be sayin the reason he went into iraq is because of Weapons of Mass Destruction did they find any? i dun think so.

if i was born in AMERICA i wouldnt be proud.

im glad i live in CANADA

[Teffo]

it's so sad how some of you ppl think...wow sometimes statistics can just be ignored and maybe some heart can be put into place...and for the person who made the comment about the second president to be catholic....oh wow what an honor a catholic who believes in abortions...or wait kennedy...a man who committed adultry and like a million crimes and consiracys,....wow im so proud!

maybe one day we can have a chaldean president....and we can be proud that he used to sell crack to kids to put himself through college...

i really dont know what im saying right now...but i want to add that...i really really hate sadam....and i really really hate kerry....i really dont like bush either...so i say....we take over canada....:)

[renee]

Oil is the reason America went into iraq *how stupid can he be sayin the reason he went into iraq is because of Weapons of Mass Destruction did they find any? i dun think so.

if i was born in AMERICA i wouldnt be proud.

im glad i live in CANADA

Yeah, since the US liberated Iraq the price of oil in the US has fallen through the floor. *:roll: *:bang:

[missbaghdad]

It's easier to convince masses of idiots (look at how affective we are in the south, and bible belt!) to vote in a particular manner.

ROTFL

:lol: * *:lol: * *:lol: * *:lol:

:alright:

[Samuel]

Oil is the reason America went into iraq *how stupid can he be sayin the reason he went into iraq is because of Weapons of Mass Destruction did they find any? i dun think so.

if i was born in AMERICA i wouldnt be proud.

im glad i live in CANADA

Yeah, since the US liberated Iraq the price of oil in the US has fallen through the floor. *:roll: *:bang:

Renee. *Don't be stupid. *Seriously. *You know damn well the Iraq war was about oil. *

Btw... Andys Wife... Do you want to know why Canada is the passive little fairy-nation that it is? *Because the United States provides security for everyone that matters. *We fight your wars. *So...SHhhhhhhhh. *


Although i will admit that Iraq wasn't your war. *It was entirely ours. *But the war on terror. *We're doing that for free. *


The United States. *We're at your service, so long as you quit bitchin' about us being better than you.

[sammiedebull]

Kerry isn't president, so who gives a crap what would have happened.

[UmiSayz]

Yeah, since the US liberated Iraq the price of oil in the US has fallen through the floor. *:roll: *:bang:


Thats because all the profit is goin to the gov't and not to the ppl.

[renee]

Yeah, since the US liberated Iraq the price of oil in the US has fallen through the floor. *:roll: *:bang:


Thats because all the profit is goin to the gov't and not to the ppl.

I wouldn't mind that. At least my taxes would go down.

[UmiSayz]

Its not goin to help your taxes either.

[ojeen1981]

US liberated Iraq???? damn, where have i been...when did this happen????

[missbaghdad]

^^lol^^

[Teffo]

i'm so sick of ppl knocking down the US for going into Iraq....WE WENT IN PPL ARE DYING FROM BOTH SIDES...IM SORRY THEY ARE DYING AND IM SORRY THAT PPL FEEL AS THOUGH IT'S FOR OIL AND BLAH BLAH BLAH...BUT SERIOUSLY GET OVER IT...YOU CANT STOP IT...

IF YOU WANTED TO STOP THIS CRAP FROM HAPPENING MAYBE MORE PPL SHOULD REGISTER TO VOTE OR ACTUALLY VOTED! *I DID!! *

NOW HOW MANY HERE VOTED? *DO YOU VOTE FOR YOUR SENATORS? *YOUR COUNTY REPRESENTATIVES....ANYTHING???? *I BET NOT....

UFFFFFFFFFFF COMPLAINERS!

[Samuel]

i'm so sick of ppl knocking down the US for going into Iraq....WE WENT IN PPL ARE DYING FROM BOTH SIDES...IM SORRY THEY ARE DYING AND IM SORRY THAT PPL FEEL AS THOUGH IT'S FOR OIL AND BLAH BLAH BLAH...BUT SERIOUSLY GET OVER IT...YOU CANT STOP IT...

IF YOU WANTED TO STOP THIS CRAP FROM HAPPENING MAYBE MORE PPL SHOULD REGISTER TO VOTE OR ACTUALLY VOTED! *I DID!! *

NOW HOW MANY HERE VOTED? *DO YOU VOTE FOR YOUR SENATORS? *YOUR COUNTY REPRESENTATIVES....ANYTHING???? *I BET NOT....

UFFFFFFFFFFF COMPLAINERS!


So because it's happening as we speak, we should all support it? *Teffo, if you lived in Nazi Germany, you would have been a Nazi long before the genocides. *Interesting. *I rather be a "complainer".


If in fact our sole intention was securing Oil supplies, then we violated the norms of sovereignty, violated the Geneva convention, defied the UN's article 51 which outlines "just" causes for war, and took a fat sh!t on morality.

[Teffo]

are you serious? *you're comparing us entering iraq to the holocust? *i think you have it confused....maybe you need to compare sadam to hitler....that makes a lot more sense!

[Samuel]

are you serious? *you're comparing us entering iraq to the holocust? *i think you have it confused....maybe you need to compare sadam to hitler....that makes a lot more sense! *


It's very obvious what i meant. *But Teffo.. I don't want to get into this with you. *:)

[Teffo]

is it because you secretly are in love wtih me? *

or because acording to some people i'm stupid, chubby, and ugly...;)

[Samuel]

is it because you secretly are in love wtih me? *

or because acording to some people i'm stupid, chubby, and ugly...;)


That's a negative on both accounts. *

It's because I don't want to yell at the moderator :band:


Jk

H to tha Izzo V to the Izza (sorry this song was playing while i made this post)

[Teffo]

like i care if you yell or not dork....are you going to turn on ur caps lock lmaooooooooooooooooo! *

honestly...it's so redundant sam....everyone sits here and complains, but i don;t see anyone here doing anything about it...if they don;t like it they should do something anything protest...man here in michigan we were supposed protest when the war was starting...and seriously NO ONE SHOWED UP....

how sad...we sit and compain but we do nothing to voice our opinions...if its so importatnt that we the assyrians and chaldean sthe first civilization (rolling of the eyes) came from iraq...shouldnt we do something about the war? *innocent ppl are dying on both sides....

[ojeen1981]

I voted...it goes beyond just voting..its about reading into the issue and realize its way way way deeper than just casting a "vote". *no one is complaining about anything, but it doesnt hirt to be educated about it. *samd, u talk like a poli. sci. and i love it....keep it up.

peace

[Teffo]

ojeen...i believe that is his major...correct me if i'm wrong here samd...

maybe i'm coming off a bit strong here...it' just everyone is just wagging their fingers at the US...and it bothers me because i feel as though people are losing site of the real issue that iraq was horrible before we even set foot into that country...

i feel bad for the people of iraq who were treated so badly...the christians believe it or not weren't even treated as bad as the muslims...as a matter of fact many christians worked for sadam because he felt he could trust them and he liked them...