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SamIAM™
07-11-2005, 01:58 PM
Do you think this is happening in America ?

A defiant Islam rises among young Britons
LONDON - Thursday's coordinated terrorist attacks that killed at least 49 people have underscored competing forces within Britain's Muslim community: a minority that advocates violence against Western targets, and those who want to coexist peacefully with Britain's multifaith, multiethnic society.

Since the bombings, the media and Muslims have been at pains to explain that most of the country's 2 million Muslims are peaceful. "The Muslim community in Britain has a long history and is enormously diverse," says Anas al-Tikriti, a member of the Muslim Association of Britain.

But the attacks are turning attention to the increasing numbers of young British Muslims who are rejecting their parents' traditional culture in favor of a radical and expansionist Islam. This strikingly Western version of Islam combines an independence of thought with a contempt for established traditional scholarship and a theme of teenage rebellion.

"Getting involved in radical Islam is an emotional thing rather than a rational decision," says Abdul-Rahman al-Helbawi, a Muslim prayer leader. "And it's not a matter of intelligence or education - a lot of these radicals in Britain are very well-educated."

In Dalston market in north-east London on Thursday, "Abdullah," a Muslim watch-mender and evangelist, was in a pugnacious mood.

"We don't need to fight. We are taking over!" he said. "We are here to bring civilization to the West. England does not belong to the English people, it belongs to God."

Two days later in a prosperous West London cafe, Mr. Helbawi pondered the attacks. "It's not a surprise but I am still shocked," he said. "How can they do this? London is a city for all the world. This is not Islam."

Hours after the bombings, Helbawi logged onto an Internet chat room run by British Muslim extremists. "They were all congratulating each other on the attacks," he said. "It was crazy. They were talking about how they had won a great victory over the infidels, as if they had just come back from a battle."

Although so far, there is no evidence that British Muslims were involved in the bombs, there is little doubt that many British Muslims feel that Britain "deserved" the attacks for supporting the US invasions of * * Iraq and * * Afghanistan.

"Because Muslims explain the conflicts in Iraq, * * Kashmir, and * * Israel through Islam, every Muslim feels involved," said Helbawi. "People watch television and see Palestinian women being hit and pushed around by Israeli soldiers, and get angry and feel that they have to do something."

But beyond anger, a sense of alienation often drives radical Islam. Many second- and third-generation immigrants find themselves cut off not only from their parents' cultures but also from a British one that includes alcohol and looser sexual mores.

"If you don't drink, it really cuts you off from English society," says Ummul Choudhury, a London-based Middle East analyst for the Gulf Centre for Strategic Studies. "The view of the older generation is also that you do not integrate. If you do, you are told you are betraying your culture and religion."

The resulting isolation makes it easier for young Muslims to develop a contempt for British society.

"There is also a lot of racism toward white British people," says Ms. Choudhury. "It's not really something that people want to talk about, but there are definitely some things that Muslims say between themselves that they would never say in front of white people."

For frustrated and isolated young Muslims, radical Islam is not difficult to find. Girls in particular are often prevented from going out at night and can be easily drawn into online Muslim communities where they come into contact with other disillusioned Muslims from across Europe.

One leading analyst of the Islamic diaspora even compares the lure of extremist Islam to 1950s teens listening to Elvis in an attempt to shock their parents. "The son of a Pentecostal preacher in Brixton was recruited by the radical Muslims," says Nadhim Shehadi, acting head of the Middle East program at Chatham House.

"This young man initially tried to upset his parents by becoming a rapper," says Shehadi. "But when his parents stopped objecting, he became a jihadi instead."

The antiestablishment nature of this new Islam and its apparent status as an alternative to capitalism and secularism is also winning converts among native Britons.

"People come to Islam from all walks of life. It's not just middle-class people but also electricians, judges, and taxi drivers," says Sara Joseph, the editor of "Emel," a lifestyle magazine for Muslim women, who converted to Islam at age 17. "The main catalyst for conversion is often going out with a Muslim, although the primary factor is usually a search for spirituality."

While the estimated 1,000 British Christians, atheists, and members of other faiths who convert to Islam every year are often attracted by Islam's clearly defined teachings, this minor trend is overshadowed by Muslims' highbirth and immigration rates, which tomany Muslims promises increased political and social influence in the future.

Indeed, taking advantage of Britain's rapidly expanding and increasingly Muslim population are new parties that aim to promote ethnic and religious agendas. One is Respect, a left-wing party founded by former Labour MP George Galloway, that aims to unite Muslims and socialists around opposition to American foreign policy and globalization.

Linked to the desire for increased political power are attempts by some radical Muslims to begin a process of Islamicizing British cities.

Last month, Muslim groups in Glasgow petitioned the City Council to ban an Italian restaurant from serving alcohol to diners seated at outside tables. Hospitals in Leicester considered banning Bibles from hospital wards to avoid offending Muslim patients. In Birmingham, a group called Muslims Against Advertising began a campaign of painting over billboards that they deemed offensive to Islam - targeting ads for Levi's jeans, perfume, and lingerie.

But these small campaigns are polarizing public opinion along ethnic and religious lines - and creating support for Britain's far-right groups, who present themselves as defenders of Britain's hard-won freedoms.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/oradical;_ylt=Ak5znzHPYaDxSTvG3Tp9fDoDW7oF;_ylu=X3 oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

UmiSayz
07-11-2005, 02:27 PM
Possibly. It can happen anywhere. Kids that gets recruited in a terrorists group doesn't have much understanding about Islam. Its like you're listening to your priests preach when you never read the bible or Imam that I never read the Quran. Its dangerous cause you can easily be manipulated into there ways of thinking. Theres no way you can tell them that you agree or disagree on there views since we haven't read the book.


Also about the Israel/Pali conflict. PPL all over the world knows whats goin on and yet nobody is doing anything about it. Palistinians are being mistreated in every humanly possible way and yet no actions are taking against Israel. Why is this? Why isn't anyone doing anything about it? PPL wants answers but nobody is recieving any.

Neo
07-13-2005, 09:27 PM
and then what

Rita
07-13-2005, 10:24 PM
I'm 99% positive it is probably happening in America. This radical group has grown so rapidly that it won't stop in Britain. Parents need to observe their children and watch for signs of misguided behavior.

Watching what is happening in Israel with the Palestinians is disturbing. These 2 groups need 2 finally come 2 some type of agreement. America has been involved in almost every country in the Middle East but have chosen to ignore the root of the problem. Meeting with the leaders a few times is not going to help. They need to do more than show their appearance to the world and cause a diversion that they are actually trying to do something there. The fighting and killing is what's causing these extremists 2 come to life and spread throughout the world. If the 2 groups can't settle, the Palestinians should find somewhere else to live. Who cares if they were there 1st. You don't see the Chaldeans/Assyrians fighting for their land after all this time. People need to accept and move on.

Also, I think it is complete BS that these Muslim groups in Britain are petitioning to ban alcohol at ITALIAN restaurants, the Bible at hospitals, & billboards against certain companies such as Levis, perfumes, etc. Since when did they rule the country? If they don't like it, I suggest they go back 2 their roots rather than try 2 change the world 2 be more like them. What's next... allowing a Muslim woman to wear the entire wrap/sheet over their head and face on their driver's liscense? Get real!!!!

Neo
07-14-2005, 12:28 AM
and then what

Rita
07-14-2005, 03:05 AM
and then what

back then they didn't want me, now i have bombs they all on me!! Bin Laden

Randel
07-14-2005, 11:18 AM
I'm 99% positive it is probably happening in America. This radical group has grown so rapidly that it won't stop in Britain. Parents need to observe their children and watch for signs of misguided behavior.

Watching what is happening in Israel with the Palestinians is disturbing. These 2 groups need 2 finally come 2 some type of agreement. America has been involved in almost every country in the Middle East but have chosen to ignore the root of the problem. Meeting with the leaders a few times is not going to help. They need to do more than show their appearance to the world and cause a diversion that they are actually trying to do something there. The fighting and killing is what's causing these extremists 2 come to life and spread throughout the world. If the 2 groups can't settle, the Palestinians should find somewhere else to live. Who cares if they were there 1st. You don't see the Chaldeans/Assyrians fighting for their land after all this time. People need to accept and move on.

Also, I think it is complete BS that these Muslim groups in Britain are petitioning to ban alcohol at ITALIAN restaurants, the Bible at hospitals, & billboards against certain companies such as Levis, perfumes, etc. Since when did they rule the country? If they don't like it, I suggest they go back 2 their roots rather than try 2 change the world 2 be more like them. What's next... allowing a Muslim woman to wear the entire wrap/sheet over their head and face on their driver's liscense? Get real!!!!

wow that was an idiotic thing to say, to tell them to just fit in with whats going on. Maybe some people actually try to do something when they dont like something instead of just complaining about it? :disgusted: *If they are not using violent *methods, what is the problem? An american is the last person who should make a statement like that.

UmiSayz
07-14-2005, 11:24 AM
wow that was an idiotic thing to say, to tell them to just fit in with whats going on. Maybe some people actually try to do something when they dont like something instead of just complaining about it? :disgusted: *If they are not using violent *methods, what is the problem? An american is the last person who should make a statement like that.


No Randel. Rita is right. In Islam God tells us even if we dont live in the Islamic gov't we must still respect there law as long as theres no harm done to us. The muslims doesn't have the right to ban alcohol or what not in a non muslim land. We're each have our own responsibilities and we will be judged as an individual.

Randel
07-14-2005, 12:16 PM
wow that was an idiotic thing to say, to tell them to just fit in with whats going on. Maybe some people actually try to do something when they dont like something instead of just complaining about it? :disgusted: *If they are not using violent *methods, what is the problem? An american is the last person who should make a statement like that.


No Randel. Rita is right. In Islam God tells us even if we dont live in the Islamic gov't we must still respect there law as long as theres no harm done to us. The muslims doesn't have the right to ban alcohol or what not in a non muslim land. We're each have our own responsibilities and we will be judged as an individual.

not everyone believes what it says in islam umisays.
sorry

UmiSayz
07-14-2005, 12:39 PM
not everyone believes what it says in islam umisays.
sorry


Im talkin about Muslims in general.

Rita
07-14-2005, 05:22 PM
Randel: So I suppose you support these extremists and their beliefs? Only the radical Muslims want to change everyone and have everyone follow their rules and way of life.

It's like saying you support the Muslim extremists in Iraq that are killing others who are not like them, destroying churches and Chaldean owned liquer stores and grocery stores. Before you argue 4 sake of arguiing with me, know what you are talking about and who you support just by objecting to my opinions. :roll:

Randel
07-14-2005, 05:34 PM
I support the extremists as long as they are not causing any harm to anyone. I don't see how TRYING to get alcohol banned is going to hurt anyone. If the majority of the people like it, it will pass, making them not extremists. If the majority of the people dont like it, it wont pass, and those people are just wasting there time ;)

Rita
07-14-2005, 06:00 PM
I support the extremists as long as they are not causing any harm to anyone. I don't see how TRYING to get alcohol banned is going to hurt anyone. If the majority of the people like it, it will pass, making them not extremists. If the majority of the people dont like it, it wont pass, and those people are just wasting there time ;)

Why do I waste my time with u? * :think:

This is the extremist group trying to change the laws. The reason they are called extremists is because they ARE out to hurt you and twist the whole religion and reason for jihad around. If they weren't, they wouldn't even be called extremists.... they would be regular & peaceful Muslims. The normal Muslims don't rule to change such things.

BTW, have some respect. You're a lil kid. I don't want 2 bother and take certain measures when u try 2 attack me in every post to make yourself feel cool or a bigger person. It only proves how immature you are. *:no no:

Randel
07-14-2005, 06:14 PM
I support the extremists as long as they are not causing any harm to anyone. I don't see how TRYING to get alcohol banned is going to hurt anyone. If the majority of the people like it, it will pass, making them not extremists. If the majority of the people dont like it, it wont pass, and those people are just wasting there time ;)

Why do I waste my time with u? * :think:

This is the extremist group trying to change the laws. The reason they are called extremists is because they ARE out to hurt you and twist the whole religion and reason for jihad around. If they weren't, they wouldn't even be called extremists.... they would be regular & peaceful Muslims. The normal Muslims don't rule to change such things.

BTW, have some respect. You're a lil kid. I don't want 2 bother and take certain measures when u try 2 attack me in every post to make yourself feel cool or a bigger person. It only proves how immature you are. *:no no:

haha you are funny. me attack you :)

Rita
07-14-2005, 09:54 PM
:roll: u 4got to say I LOVE U RITA!!! :love:

LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Randel
07-14-2005, 09:59 PM
:love: i love you rita *:love:

i get a point or something for this right?

Rita
07-15-2005, 02:01 AM
no randel, you can't buy love. lol :)

Randel
07-15-2005, 10:45 AM
dont we get 2 points for making a post?

sammiedebull
07-15-2005, 01:09 PM
These kids are "brainwashed". Thats pretty obvious, i also agree 100% with rita, the israel / palestinian issue MUST be resolved, when they recruit these kids, they say "Look what the jews and americans are doing in our homeland, they are killing kids, women, etc". For an average muslim even, if someone shows you pictures, tells you this, shows you what is happening that the jews powered bu america/britian are doing this than they will have some influence on someone who is easily convienced to take it to thenext level of extremism.